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Author Topic: The Correct Opinion Thread  (Read 1685 times)

Crohn's Boy

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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #180 on: February 27, 2018, 04:01:36 pm »
Peter Rabbit is a good movie.
Goodbye!
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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #181 on: February 27, 2018, 04:03:48 pm »
I wanted to start writing walls of text on here again with a reply to Diego on Russian election thread (I totally haven't forgotten about that, btw; even have a half-written draft, but I keep changing stuff as I've been getting in political arguments with other Russians online and irl) or maybe one on the political compass one, but there's been so much wrong said in the main argument here that it'll have to wait. From the first Danny's post on the issue:

And before anyone makes the equally simplistic and ignorant argument that China doesnít cast white people in their movies:
1) Yes they do. All the time lmao. Their biggest film of 2017 starred Frank Grillo. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolf_Warrior_2
2) China is a homogenous country that doesnít claim to be an ethnic cultural melting pot. On the contrary, the US absolutely does, thatís one of the founding ideals this country was built on.

First, going from "all the time" to one example from one year is rather simplistic to say the least. Yes, it's a prominent example by the virtue of being their highest-grossing film in that year, but it's just that, one film, and you can only compare it to the highest-grossing films in US by year. (Which is a losing argument for you, because really, when was the last time a highest-grossing US film starred fewer minorities than Wolf Warrior 2? I suppose American Sniper had about as many evil Arab characters as Wolf Warrior 2 had evil white characters + good half-white girl, but that might be it.)

The idea of China as a "homogenous country" is rather disingenuous. They have some 60 recognised ethnic minorities with quotas to send a minimum number of their representatives into their National Congress (not including religious minorities like ethnic Han Muslims (Hui), class minorities like 200 million internal migrants workers with some 80 representatives, or political minorities like a delegation of exiled Taiwanese Maoists' children warming seats for the time Taiwan is reintegrated and real Taiwanese can take their place.) Yes, those are nearly all minorities of other Asians (including 3 times more Mongolians than live in actual Mongolia; a fact that allows Ghenghis Khan and his empire to be considered culturally Chinese in China), but that's a very different situation from claiming they are a"homogenous" or an "ethnostate" like you do later on. (And in case this comes up somehow, Russia is even less of an ethnostate than China, with our hundreds of both European and Turkic/Asian minorities, and most Russians, me included, being heavily mixed with other ethniticites since time immemorial. Our greatest poet was hailed as such while having a black great-grandfather in 19th century, and the people who still celebrate Stalin knowingly commemorate the rule of a Georgian over Russians.)

I probably should have specified that I was referring to the cultural appropriation case (as that was what I assumed John was referring to when talking about Ghost in the Shell). I'm perfectly fine with casting diversity as long as the actors themselves reap solid performances.
Thatís great... but it doesnít really explain why you believe whitewashing is equivalent to Black/Asian/Latin/Middle Eastern-washing(?).

I don't really want to argue over anything to do with last year's Ghost in the Shell (honestly, this whole argument made me want to see it, more than anything else; I'm just unwilling to do so without watching at least some of the original.) However, I do think it's funny that many of the same people making Danny's points at the time then attacked the Death Note remake before its release for "blackwashing", which kinda suggests that for them it was more about their own minority interests than any of the greater intellectual reasons.

That ďthis is a white country so most roles understandably go to white actorsĒ argument doesnít work because the US isnít a white country. Itís not homogeneous and doesnít claim to be either. I donít wanna repeat this again, but the US was founded on the idea of an ethnic cultural melting pot. Meaning various different races interacting with other different races, and there being no one single race. Weíre not an ethnostate.

The thing is, "most roles go to white actors because whites are the largest "racial group"" (which is what Braden said; I don't see his post asserting a "white country" idea, which is what you justifiably argue against) does not conflict with "various different races interacting with other different races". In fact pretty much any movie that includes characters of several "races" fulfills it already: every superhero movie for the past 20 years or so, police movies like Lethal Weapon series, End of Watch or Rush Hour movies, middle-of-the-road dramas like The Mountain Between Us or The Hundred-Foot-Journey (ok that might have been British; I just remember it screening a lot in Australia at the time), most Twilight movies (most werewolves in those were non-white, right?), shitty remakes of Total Recall and Robocop that made protagonist's friend black while they were white in Verhoeven's original, etc. I mean really, your different posts argue for different things, some f which are already achieved.

Furthermore, as stated earlier, most foreign films do not have the global reach of most American films. They have no obligation or reasonsibility to do anything.

Which leads me into repeating another point, and that is American films arenít just made for Americans anymore. At least not the blockbusters. Why are the highest grossest films of all time from US production companies? Because the US makes films that are influential around the entire world. White Americans are no longer the sole audience they should/would/have to cater to. Itís extremely close minded to only think about white Americans when Hollywood films are clearly a global commodity now. And as a result, their portrayals of certain groups have an impact on how people perceive those groups. People are socialized to behave and think a certain way by the media they consume. Thatís why people get annoyed when you have another film that depicts all Muslims as American hating terrorists, for example. Is that really necessary or even helpful when you already have Fox News drilling that notion into the heads of gullible citizens?

If you REALLY wanna make this into a demographics issue, than technically within the context of the world (which films from the US absolutely fit into), every actor in an American production should be Chinese, since the Chinese outnumber everybody else globally.

You know, the interesting thing about this post, and others Danny later made in the same vein, is that it actually expresses patriotism, albeit in a strange and roundabout way.

As in, he identifies that American films have substantially more reach than those of other countries (though I would argue that he's overestimating that by some degree. I might have seen Wonder in Russia, for instance, but very, very few others here did: it was gone from the theaters very quickly, its overall non-American gross was something like 2 million, and I am practically certain a fair number of European films like Cold Skin or Japanese/Korean/Hong Kong movies/animations fared a lot better than it did. Similarly, we had Indian Bhaaubali (?) 2 screen quite widely here, and I already saw Black Pathner reviews asserting it wasn't as good as the Indian movie.) and what he wants is to preserve this disparity in reach and influence and perpetuate it by changing the make-up of those movies in ways he thinks will help that, rather than strengthening the foreign movies themselves and their reach, and encouraging non-white people outside America project depictions of themselves globally by seeing their works when they actually do so. For him, a film shaped by multi-million corp suits in America to have a desired degree of diversity matters more, and is superior to, a film made in a foreign country by usually significantly less-funded creative team. It was notably on display last year when he debated on here seeing Power Rangers remake over Kong because of its greater corporate-driven diversity, not even considering any options to stay at home and see foreign works.

I would also say that the kind of corporate diversity he wants more prevalent in US blockbusters for the benefit of us, the global audiences, can, and does, backfire. I know you do not care what the masses of (substantially more socially conservative on average) people from here and Eastern Europe think when you talk about global audiences, but for a good number of them, diversity is a joke in good part because of the bubble-gum approach Danny champions, or at least is aligned with a lot of the time. For them, it's the same ind of homogenization as the spread of McDonalds i.e. not a good thing. This may not be the right response, and I am often embararassed by the cringy "politically incorrect" discourse on Russian pop-culture forums, but again, I should note that neither the Soviet-era films with their share of non-white characters, nor, say, 60s-80s Bollywood films that were extremely popular here as a result of various cooperation initiatives with India, and are still watched today, provoke anything like the same response. So, I should just say be careful what you wish for.

If you want more anecdotal evidence, I have a Tuvan friend (Tuvans are one of our Asian minorities; Defence Minister Shoigu is another member), who in theory, should be a prime target for the diversity initiatives Danny pushes, and yet, when we discuss films, I don't think he ever cared about Asians in Hollywood or how they are represented. He likes the same white and black mainstream Hollywood actors everyone else does, and when he watches films about Asians, it's usually a Korean martial arts movie. (Which he is quite passionate about; he actually got me to watch two of them last month, which was certainly an experience.) OK, technically, he did also encourage me to watch (rather crappy) American Shaolin...which has a white lead going to China, kind of making Danny's point moot again.

Interestingly, talking to him also established something relevant about the other thing discussed in the thread - the proportional representation. I know Danny said he doesn't want it anyway, but interestingly, while it sounds like a good thing theoretically, I am actually not so sure any human society naturally gravitates towards it. What seems to happen is that a relatively slight majority (55-70%) will usually have more like 90% of the signifciant, representative posts, and demographic changes then lead not to true proportional representation, but the new majority taking over. I am basing it off some recent debate in his region, Tuva Republic, where Tuvans themselves are like 65% and ethnic Russians 20%, yet some places in governing apparatus, like the treasury, are now entirely Tuvan, obviously leading to complaints from ethnic Russians there. Equally obviously, he (and his region's officials) dismissed it with "Why should any of this matter if we are all Russian citizens who should work together for the benefit of all of us? Why should ehtnic Russians be any more represented than region's ethnic Poles or Kazakhs?" So, the disproportionate presence of a (localised) majority actually seems to be more of a universal organising principle, no matter who that majority is, rather than something that would go away with enough "social justice".
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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #182 on: February 27, 2018, 05:02:09 pm »
I wanted to start writing walls of text on here again with a reply to Diego on Russian election thread (I totally haven't forgotten about that, btw; even have a half-written draft, but I keep changing stuff as I've been getting in political arguments with other Russians online and irl) or maybe one on the political compass one, but there's been so much wrong said in the main argument here that it'll have to wait. From the first Danny's post on the issue:

And before anyone makes the equally simplistic and ignorant argument that China doesnít cast white people in their movies:
1) Yes they do. All the time lmao. Their biggest film of 2017 starred Frank Grillo. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolf_Warrior_2
2) China is a homogenous country that doesnít claim to be an ethnic cultural melting pot. On the contrary, the US absolutely does, thatís one of the founding ideals this country was built on.

First, going from "all the time" to one example from one year is rather simplistic to say the least. Yes, it's a prominent example by the virtue of being their highest-grossing film in that year, but it's just that, one film, and you can only compare it to the highest-grossing films in US by year. (Which is a losing argument for you, because really, when was the last time a highest-grossing US film starred fewer minorities than Wolf Warrior 2? I suppose American Sniper had about as many evil Arab characters as Wolf Warrior 2 had evil white characters + good half-white girl, but that might be it.)

The idea of China as a "homogenous country" is rather disingenuous. They have some 60 recognised ethnic minorities with quotas to send a minimum number of their representatives into their National Congress (not including religious minorities like ethnic Han Muslims (Hui), class minorities like 200 million internal migrants workers with some 80 representatives, or political minorities like a delegation of exiled Taiwanese Maoists' children warming seats for the time Taiwan is reintegrated and real Taiwanese can take their place.) Yes, those are nearly all minorities of other Asians (including 3 times more Mongolians than live in actual Mongolia; a fact that allows Ghenghis Khan and his empire to be considered culturally Chinese in China), but that's a very different situation from claiming they are a"homogenous" or an "ethnostate" like you do later on. (And in case this comes up somehow, Russia is even less of an ethnostate than China, with our hundreds of both European and Turkic/Asian minorities, and most Russians, me included, being heavily mixed with other ethniticites since time immemorial. Our greatest poet was hailed as such while having a black great-grandfather in 19th century, and the people who still celebrate Stalin knowingly commemorate the rule of a Georgian over Russians.)

I probably should have specified that I was referring to the cultural appropriation case (as that was what I assumed John was referring to when talking about Ghost in the Shell). I'm perfectly fine with casting diversity as long as the actors themselves reap solid performances.
Thatís great... but it doesnít really explain why you believe whitewashing is equivalent to Black/Asian/Latin/Middle Eastern-washing(?).

I don't really want to argue over anything to do with last year's Ghost in the Shell (honestly, this whole argument made me want to see it, more than anything else; I'm just unwilling to do so without watching at least some of the original.) However, I do think it's funny that many of the same people making Danny's points at the time then attacked the Death Note remake before its release for "blackwashing", which kinda suggests that for them it was more about their own minority interests than any of the greater intellectual reasons.

That ďthis is a white country so most roles understandably go to white actorsĒ argument doesnít work because the US isnít a white country. Itís not homogeneous and doesnít claim to be either. I donít wanna repeat this again, but the US was founded on the idea of an ethnic cultural melting pot. Meaning various different races interacting with other different races, and there being no one single race. Weíre not an ethnostate.

The thing is, "most roles go to white actors because whites are the largest "racial group"" (which is what Braden said; I don't see his post asserting a "white country" idea, which is what you justifiably argue against) does not conflict with "various different races interacting with other different races". In fact pretty much any movie that includes characters of several "races" fulfills it already: every superhero movie for the past 20 years or so, police movies like Lethal Weapon series, End of Watch or Rush Hour movies, middle-of-the-road dramas like The Mountain Between Us or The Hundred-Foot-Journey (ok that might have been British; I just remember it screening a lot in Australia at the time), most Twilight movies (most werewolves in those were non-white, right?), shitty remakes of Total Recall and Robocop that made protagonist's friend black while they were white in Verhoeven's original, etc. I mean really, your different posts argue for different things, some f which are already achieved.

Furthermore, as stated earlier, most foreign films do not have the global reach of most American films. They have no obligation or reasonsibility to do anything.

Which leads me into repeating another point, and that is American films arenít just made for Americans anymore. At least not the blockbusters. Why are the highest grossest films of all time from US production companies? Because the US makes films that are influential around the entire world. White Americans are no longer the sole audience they should/would/have to cater to. Itís extremely close minded to only think about white Americans when Hollywood films are clearly a global commodity now. And as a result, their portrayals of certain groups have an impact on how people perceive those groups. People are socialized to behave and think a certain way by the media they consume. Thatís why people get annoyed when you have another film that depicts all Muslims as American hating terrorists, for example. Is that really necessary or even helpful when you already have Fox News drilling that notion into the heads of gullible citizens?

If you REALLY wanna make this into a demographics issue, than technically within the context of the world (which films from the US absolutely fit into), every actor in an American production should be Chinese, since the Chinese outnumber everybody else globally.

You know, the interesting thing about this post, and others Danny later made in the same vein, is that it actually expresses patriotism, albeit in a strange and roundabout way.

As in, he identifies that American films have substantially more reach than those of other countries (though I would argue that he's overestimating that by some degree. I might have seen Wonder in Russia, for instance, but very, very few others here did: it was gone from the theaters very quickly, its overall non-American gross was something like 2 million, and I am practically certain a fair number of European films like Cold Skin or Japanese/Korean/Hong Kong movies/animations fared a lot better than it did. Similarly, we had Indian Bhaaubali (?) 2 screen quite widely here, and I already saw Black Pathner reviews asserting it wasn't as good as the Indian movie.) and what he wants is to preserve this disparity in reach and influence and perpetuate it by changing the make-up of those movies in ways he thinks will help that, rather than strengthening the foreign movies themselves and their reach, and encouraging non-white people outside America project depictions of themselves globally by seeing their works when they actually do so. For him, a film shaped by multi-million corp suits in America to have a desired degree of diversity matters more, and is superior to, a film made in a foreign country by usually significantly less-funded creative team. It was notably on display last year when he debated on here seeing Power Rangers remake over Kong because of its greater corporate-driven diversity, not even considering any options to stay at home and see foreign works.

I would also say that the kind of corporate diversity he wants more prevalent in US blockbusters for the benefit of us, the global audiences, can, and does, backfire. I know you do not care what the masses of (substantially more socially conservative on average) people from here and Eastern Europe think when you talk about global audiences, but for a good number of them, diversity is a joke in good part because of the bubble-gum approach Danny champions, or at least is aligned with a lot of the time. For them, it's the same ind of homogenization as the spread of McDonalds i.e. not a good thing. This may not be the right response, and I am often embararassed by the cringy "politically incorrect" discourse on Russian pop-culture forums, but again, I should note that neither the Soviet-era films with their share of non-white characters, nor, say, 60s-80s Bollywood films that were extremely popular here as a result of various cooperation initiatives with India, and are still watched today, provoke anything like the same response. So, I should just say be careful what you wish for.

If you want more anecdotal evidence, I have a Tuvan friend (Tuvans are one of our Asian minorities; Defence Minister Shoigu is another member), who in theory, should be a prime target for the diversity initiatives Danny pushes, and yet, when we discuss films, I don't think he ever cared about Asians in Hollywood or how they are represented. He likes the same white and black mainstream Hollywood actors everyone else does, and when he watches films about Asians, it's usually a Korean martial arts movie. (Which he is quite passionate about; he actually got me to watch two of them last month, which was certainly an experience.) OK, technically, he did also encourage me to watch (rather crappy) American Shaolin...which has a white lead going to China, kind of making Danny's point moot again.

Interestingly, talking to him also established something relevant about the other thing discussed in the thread - the proportional representation. I know Danny said he doesn't want it anyway, but interestingly, while it sounds like a good thing theoretically, I am actually not so sure any human society naturally gravitates towards it. What seems to happen is that a relatively slight majority (55-70%) will usually have more like 90% of the signifciant, representative posts, and demographic changes then lead not to true proportional representation, but the new majority taking over. I am basing it off some recent debate in his region, Tuva Republic, where Tuvans themselves are like 65% and ethnic Russians 20%, yet some places in governing apparatus, like the treasury, are now entirely Tuvan, obviously leading to complaints from ethnic Russians there. Equally obviously, he (and his region's officials) dismissed it with "Why should any of this matter if we are all Russian citizens who should work together for the benefit of all of us? Why should ehtnic Russians be any more represented than region's ethnic Poles or Kazakhs?" So, the disproportionate presence of a (localised) majority actually seems to be more of a universal organising principle, no matter who that majority is, rather than something that would go away with enough "social justice".
I donít really disagree with any of this. I was working within a framework where the US is the dominant film capital of the world, of course Iíd love if the global film industry was a lot more democratized.

The only thing Iíd like to note is your assessment of why people were against L being cast as a black man is pretty disingenuous. Itís also obvious that his character wasnít really the focus of that controversy either.

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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #183 on: February 27, 2018, 05:27:58 pm »
The thing is, "most roles go to white actors because whites are the largest "racial group" (which is what Braden said; I don't see his post asserting a "white country" idea, which is what you justifiably argue against) does not conflict with "various different races interacting with other different races". In fact pretty much any movie that includes characters of several "races" fulfills it already: every superhero movie for the past 20 years or so, police movies like Lethal Weapon series, End of Watch or Rush Hour movies, middle-of-the-road dramas like The Mountain Between Us or The Hundred-Foot-Journey (ok that might have been British; I just remember it screening a lot in Australia at the time), most Twilight movies (most werewolves in those were non-white, right?), shitty remakes of Total Recall and Robocop that made protagonist's friend black while they were white in Verhoeven's original, etc. I mean really, your different posts argue for different things, some of which are already achieved.

This is by far the most infuriating thing about arguing with Danny. He literally moves the goalposts with every single post he makes. First it's no more whitewashing, then it's equal representation, then suddenly the goal is unequal representation that explicitly favors his own ethnic group. I can't possibly imagine why he'd be biased towards that particular goal. As you note elsewhere in your comment, it's literally just multicultural countries like the US and Canada that seem to have these problems. The 99% of Asians who live elsewhere could not give less of a shit.

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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #184 on: February 27, 2018, 05:30:59 pm »
The thing is, "most roles go to white actors because whites are the largest "racial group" (which is what Braden said; I don't see his post asserting a "white country" idea, which is what you justifiably argue against) does not conflict with "various different races interacting with other different races". In fact pretty much any movie that includes characters of several "races" fulfills it already: every superhero movie for the past 20 years or so, police movies like Lethal Weapon series, End of Watch or Rush Hour movies, middle-of-the-road dramas like The Mountain Between Us or The Hundred-Foot-Journey (ok that might have been British; I just remember it screening a lot in Australia at the time), most Twilight movies (most werewolves in those were non-white, right?), shitty remakes of Total Recall and Robocop that made protagonist's friend black while they were white in Verhoeven's original, etc. I mean really, your different posts argue for different things, some of which are already achieved.

This is by far the most infuriating thing about arguing with Danny. He literally moves the goalposts with every single post he makes. First it's no more whitewashing, then it's equal representation, then suddenly the goal is unequal representation that explicitly favors his own ethnic group. I can't possibly imagine why he'd be biased towards that particular goal. As you note elsewhere in your comment, it's literally just multicultural countries like the US and Canada that seem to have these problems. The 99% of Asians who live elsewhere could not give less of a shit.

I literally texted this to Bread last night during the whole Danny Oh thing...

"hard to argue with someone who doesn't even understand the content of their own posts"

perhaps "move the goalposts" is a more apt description though...

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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #185 on: February 27, 2018, 06:03:56 pm »
The thing is, "most roles go to white actors because whites are the largest "racial group" (which is what Braden said; I don't see his post asserting a "white country" idea, which is what you justifiably argue against) does not conflict with "various different races interacting with other different races". In fact pretty much any movie that includes characters of several "races" fulfills it already: every superhero movie for the past 20 years or so, police movies like Lethal Weapon series, End of Watch or Rush Hour movies, middle-of-the-road dramas like The Mountain Between Us or The Hundred-Foot-Journey (ok that might have been British; I just remember it screening a lot in Australia at the time), most Twilight movies (most werewolves in those were non-white, right?), shitty remakes of Total Recall and Robocop that made protagonist's friend black while they were white in Verhoeven's original, etc. I mean really, your different posts argue for different things, some of which are already achieved.

This is by far the most infuriating thing about arguing with Danny. He literally moves the goalposts with every single post he makes. First it's no more whitewashing, then it's equal representation, then suddenly the goal is unequal representation that explicitly favors his own ethnic group. I can't possibly imagine why he'd be biased towards that particular goal. As you note elsewhere in your comment, it's literally just multicultural countries like the US and Canada that seem to have these problems. The 99% of Asians who live elsewhere could not give less of a shit.
Wait what? I thought we established my comment about China was clearly a joke.

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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #187 on: February 27, 2018, 06:10:33 pm »
The thing is, "most roles go to white actors because whites are the largest "racial group" (which is what Braden said; I don't see his post asserting a "white country" idea, which is what you justifiably argue against) does not conflict with "various different races interacting with other different races". In fact pretty much any movie that includes characters of several "races" fulfills it already: every superhero movie for the past 20 years or so, police movies like Lethal Weapon series, End of Watch or Rush Hour movies, middle-of-the-road dramas like The Mountain Between Us or The Hundred-Foot-Journey (ok that might have been British; I just remember it screening a lot in Australia at the time), most Twilight movies (most werewolves in those were non-white, right?), shitty remakes of Total Recall and Robocop that made protagonist's friend black while they were white in Verhoeven's original, etc. I mean really, your different posts argue for different things, some of which are already achieved.

This is by far the most infuriating thing about arguing with Danny. He literally moves the goalposts with every single post he makes. First it's no more whitewashing, then it's equal representation, then suddenly the goal is unequal representation that explicitly favors his own ethnic group. I can't possibly imagine why he'd be biased towards that particular goal. As you note elsewhere in your comment, it's literally just multicultural countries like the US and Canada that seem to have these problems. The 99% of Asians who live elsewhere could not give less of a shit.
Wait what? I thought we established my comment about China was clearly a joke.
And the only reason my arguments kept shifting was because the conversation kept shifting. My original point was that drawing comparisons between white-washing and casting people of color in traditionally white roles was a false equivalence. This also means that Iím against whitewashing naturally. Then Bread comes in and completely denies the importance of representation with an argument centered on proportional representation and that whitewashing is the same thing as black, Latino, Asian, Middle Eastern washing. So I naturally added to my counter arguments to address his points.

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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #188 on: February 27, 2018, 06:28:19 pm »
Better Call Saul > Breakikg Bad, so far at least.
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Tut

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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #189 on: February 27, 2018, 06:44:46 pm »
The thing is, "most roles go to white actors because whites are the largest "racial group" (which is what Braden said; I don't see his post asserting a "white country" idea, which is what you justifiably argue against) does not conflict with "various different races interacting with other different races". In fact pretty much any movie that includes characters of several "races" fulfills it already: every superhero movie for the past 20 years or so, police movies like Lethal Weapon series, End of Watch or Rush Hour movies, middle-of-the-road dramas like The Mountain Between Us or The Hundred-Foot-Journey (ok that might have been British; I just remember it screening a lot in Australia at the time), most Twilight movies (most werewolves in those were non-white, right?), shitty remakes of Total Recall and Robocop that made protagonist's friend black while they were white in Verhoeven's original, etc. I mean really, your different posts argue for different things, some of which are already achieved.

This is by far the most infuriating thing about arguing with Danny. He literally moves the goalposts with every single post he makes. First it's no more whitewashing, then it's equal representation, then suddenly the goal is unequal representation that explicitly favors his own ethnic group. I can't possibly imagine why he'd be biased towards that particular goal. As you note elsewhere in your comment, it's literally just multicultural countries like the US and Canada that seem to have these problems. The 99% of Asians who live elsewhere could not give less of a shit.
Wait what? I thought we established my comment about China was clearly a joke.
And the only reason my arguments kept shifting was because the conversation kept shifting. My original point was that drawing comparisons between white-washing and casting people of color in traditionally white roles was a false equivalence. This also means that Iím against whitewashing naturally. Then Bread comes in and completely denies the importance of representation with an argument centered on proportional representation and that whitewashing is the same thing as black, Latino, Asian, Middle Eastern washing. So I naturally added to my counter arguments to address his points.

There is no false equivalence. If you're not okay with white Major, you can't be okay with black Bond. Simple as that.
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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #190 on: February 27, 2018, 06:45:05 pm »
Breakikg Bad
I can't say I've heard of Breakikg Bad. Is it as good as Breaking Bad?
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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #191 on: February 27, 2018, 06:59:59 pm »
Breakikg Bad

Why do you hate Jewish people?  They should be represented equally as well, no?

$+/\|_°|\|

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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #192 on: February 27, 2018, 08:08:20 pm »
Breakikg Bad

Why do you hate Jewish people?  They should be represented equally as well, no?
I get the joke, but itís kind of a reach.

Crohn's Boy

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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #193 on: February 27, 2018, 08:11:04 pm »
Breakikg Bad

Why do you hate Jewish people?  They should be represented equally as well, no?
I appreciate your wit, but this is not okay.
Goodbye!

Flounder Prefers Browntown

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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #194 on: February 27, 2018, 08:26:24 pm »
You're not even going to fix your spelling error, Oh Danny Boy?

smh
Everything is terrible.

Crohn's Boy

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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #195 on: February 27, 2018, 10:04:35 pm »
Cats > Dogs
Goodbye!
Like Like x 2 Disagree Disagree x 3 Dumb Dumb x 1 View List

Robert Neville

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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #196 on: February 28, 2018, 02:56:23 pm »
Christopher Nolan and Zack Snyder both have obnoxious fanbases.

Honestly, is there such a thing as a good fanbase? By definition, they are made up of people who project their need for group identity (which, to be fair, is an innate human need) onto works of fiction instead of anything more consequential. By extension, anything to do "the fandom", especially any perceived threats to it, is treated with the overblown importance we've seen, and mocked, so often over the past few years. Hence, while there are certainly films/books/games/creators I like, I legitimately wouldn't say I am part of any one fandom, no matter how hard I try to think of examples.

Tut

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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #197 on: February 28, 2018, 06:51:38 pm »
Christopher Nolan and Zack Snyder both have obnoxious fanbases.

Honestly, is there such a thing as a good fanbase? By definition, they are made up of people who project their need for group identity (which, to be fair, is an innate human need) onto works of fiction instead of anything more consequential. By extension, anything to do "the fandom", especially any perceived threats to it, is treated with the overblown importance we've seen, and mocked, so often over the past few years. Hence, while there are certainly films/books/games/creators I like, I legitimately wouldn't say I am part of any one fandom, no matter how hard I try to think of examples.

I've found that the more cringeworthy fandoms skew to one gender or the other. Doctor Who fangirls and Star Trek/Wars fanboys are among the worst because of how pitiful and lonely they all are, since they are seen as repulsive by the opposite sex. However, when you get something that appeals more or less equally to both men and women (I'd name Firefly and Game of Thrones here), the fans are a lot easier to deal with. The more homogeneous the fandom is, the more insular and self-loathing it becomes.

Not to say that the latter fan groups aren't awful sometimes, but they're objectively less faggoty than DC fanboys.

ChillinDylan Godsend

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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #198 on: February 28, 2018, 06:59:23 pm »
Christopher Nolan and Zack Snyder both have obnoxious fanbases.

Honestly, is there such a thing as a good fanbase? By definition, they are made up of people who project their need for group identity (which, to be fair, is an innate human need) onto works of fiction instead of anything more consequential. By extension, anything to do "the fandom", especially any perceived threats to it, is treated with the overblown importance we've seen, and mocked, so often over the past few years. Hence, while there are certainly films/books/games/creators I like, I legitimately wouldn't say I am part of any one fandom, no matter how hard I try to think of examples.

I've found that the more cringeworthy fandoms skew to one gender or the other. Doctor Who fangirls and Star Trek/Wars fanboys are among the worst because of how pitiful and lonely they all are, since they are seen as repulsive by the opposite sex. However, when you get something that appeals more or less equally to both men and women (I'd name Firefly and Game of Thrones here), the fans are a lot easier to deal with. The more homogeneous the fandom is, the more insular and self-loathing it becomes.

Not to say that the latter fan groups aren't awful sometimes, but they're objectively less faggoty than DC fanboys.

Fanboys in general are inherently obnoxious and faggy imo...

Pretty much akin to staunch Republicans and staunch Democrats...

Charles Longboat Jr.

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Re: The Correct Opinion Thread
« Reply #199 on: March 11, 2018, 02:21:59 pm »
Almond/cashew milk is useless stomach filler. You might as well drink water.

 

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